Is American Democracy too big to fail?

Discussion in 'Religion & Politics' started by Dr. Rice, Sep 20, 2012.

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  1. Dr. Rice

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    http://truth-out.org/opinion/item/11391-democracy-is-a-continent-too-big

    [​IMG]

    This regional syndicalist opinion writer thinks that it is desirable for some change to the status quo.

    The question is what do you think is acceptable? Should Federal government reform, decentralize, or dissolve the Union into smaller blocks?
     
  2. skylerconcarne

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    String them all up.
     
  3. Lyle

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  4. umkemesik

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    The Federal Government has become too large and lazy. I don't mind Hedgemony - many laws should be the same from State to State.

    But many Federal Departments are useless. The EPA. The Department of Energy. The Department of "Education". And so on and so on. That is not to say that these Departments do not perform essential tasks, Environmental Protection is essential, but it need not be overbearing.

    Also lol this thread. We do not live in a "Democracy" we live in an Oligarchy under a modified Police State.
     
  5. MrGask

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  6. Solution

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    Too large for our benefit, certainly.
    Large enough for their intention, hardly.
    As far as lazy, not at all.
    Washington works tirelessly and with out pause to find new progressive ways to help us enjoy them ass fucking away our personal rights.

    American "democracy" is in no way too big to fail,
    it's just out growing it's apple pie rhetoric

    Edit: Shit I almost forgot... Spic.
     
  7. umkemesik

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    not funny.
     
  8. scumhook

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    Reform and centralise.

    I base this opinion upon nothing except my genius and devastating good looks.

    Oh, and my penis. Mostly based upon my penis.
     
  9. demongoat

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    i agree with this.

    how is the epa useless? do you know what the epa does? it keeps corporations from dumping shit into our lakes and streams, poisoning the land and the water, killing animals and us.
    before the epa was created you could set fire to the cuyahoga river, in fact is was set on fire 13 times.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cuyahoga_River
    the river was the catalyst for why the epa was created.

    we may be turning into an oligarchy but when we are forced under threats of getting shot if we are out after a set curfew and we can't criticize the government and we need documents to go anywhere and at the whim of the state they can kill us, then you can call america a police state.
    we aren't yet, and i don't see it happening any time soon, too many people will fight, too many people will get angry, and i don't think the police or armed forces would be enough to stop the american populace.

    why are we taught all about how the founding fathers rebelled and made their own country? if they truly wanted to institute a police state they wouldn't teach us about rebellion.
     
  10. GSTalbert1

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    How odd I'm studying for my American history exam how interesting that you posted this. I'm going to fluctuate between this and mes études buuuut @Dr. Rice you know me I'm all for local empowerment. I honestly believe that there is a vast government infrastructure within our local municipalities that I feel is so underutilized because people only vote for the big ticket elections despite the fact that there their vote has the least impact. Take legalizing pot, why fight the long grueling fight to end national legislation when you can take care of it locally? When most major city mayoral elections are won with single digits, how many people actually vote for judges, the local sheriff, or the DA; now, how many people smoke pot? You could effectively, as some towns have managed, make pot de facto legal by requesting our law enforcement simply focus the limited resources they possess towards more productive ends and in return they get the stoner vote which would only need no more than 1-2k as a group. You also have a range of legal structures to protect and empower our municipalities that would allow us to pretty much do whatever the fuck we want. More so than our government is our economy which we need to work en mass to reclaim from this massive sharecropping scam known as franchising. Utilizing existing legal structures cities have kept out big box retail chains (of every dollar spent at a chain store 13 cents and up stays in your community in relation to local businesses that's a 52% tax on the economic community as a whole. Wonder why the ghetto niggers are 3rd world poor? Because rather than making their own fucking shit they have Nike sell them $1.72 shoes for $300 a pop), ensured communal ownership of land without infringing on property rights (ensures no one can own land in your community that doesn't live in your community without majority approval of the residents), and protected natural resources (can't find source but local town stopped a corporation from the forcible acquisition of a public water source). Forcing people to change doesn't work, people in America have to start minding their own business and stop worrying what's going on in Dallas or NYC or San Fran and start focusing on their own shit in their own towns.


    Your comment reminds me of Montesquieu
    • Useless laws weaken the necessary laws.
      • Book XXIX, Chapter 16De l'Esprit des Lois
    No I haven't read him yet, but I did read his wikiquote page months ago.
     
  11. GSTalbert1

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    Follow up on the last TL;DR post:
    Our government isn't reacting fast enough to a rapidly changing world that our historical structures were not equipped to deal with. I am definitely for the spirit of our laws but not the letter. Grapsing what our system is meant to do vrs what it's doing while having a grasp of modern technology and the world it's created is vital. A quick pro-level updater on our government is the federalist papers. They are 85 short 2-6 page essays that were originally published in a newspaper. Not only are they exceptionally easy to read and strangely exciting, even in these modern times, they are so well written the craftsmanship that went into them is worth it alone, srsly I swear to Jesus, Daddy, and the Spook. These essays were written Anonymously under the nome de plume "Publius" for the everyman and explain the constitution in full and by the end of it you will have a working knowledge of the constitution and the SPIRIT behind it and each essay takes you no more than 4-10 minutes to finish. Because it's written for a weekly newsletter you could take several weeks in between readings without issue. I would read about 4-5 essays a day on my bus ride to work in that other city I use to live in. Their commentary on the nature of politics is honestly second to none. The political structure they built was honestly as flawless as they come in terms of ensuring internal stability.



    I've got my prescription amphetamines and I'm doing an all nighter so basically it's:
    [​IMG]
     
  12. umkemesik

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    All States have their own EPA. A federal agency is not needed. Federal oversight of the State EPA's can be performed by Statute and the Inspector General/Attorney General.

    Similarly, every State controls their own education, the Department of Education is useless.
     
  13. MrGask

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    Revised for accuracy. All government agencies are reactionary in nature.
     
  14. umkemesik

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    From your own sauce:

    Ohio EPA, not Federal EPA cleaned that river. I rest my case.
     
  15. uberfukken

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    There is a better deterrent than a federal agency swinging it's dick around.

    Let land owners take action against polluters who damage their water/air/soil. With the EPA, polluters are immune to prosecution so long as they follow regulations (bribes pls). If you take the EPA out, polluters can be prosecuted under tort laws, suffer millions of dollars in penalties paid directly to the affected community, and the corporate officers can be thrown in jail.

    Fuck the EPA. People think they are protecting the environment. No, they are protecting big-money industry, and they're using tax dollars to do it.
     
  16. Khanzer

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    umm I don't want to sound like PerpA but how is this a news?
     
  17. Scorch

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    Lol @ insinuating that America is a Police State.

    Just stop pls.
     
  18. Hemlock

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    It has already failed.
     
  19. Dr. Rice

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  20. Whatever

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    Even though I'm a person that's usually for bigger government, I can see the validity of this theory.
    Individual states have different issues to deal with than the rest of the country.

    I'm still for regulations, since I don't really trust anything to do anything right, or businesses to do what's right out of the kindness of their hearts, but I don't see why regulations can't be handled on the state level.
     
  21. GSTalbert1

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    I am honestly ignorant of the EPA and my knowledge of it is solely from mainstream media and thus wholly inadequate. However, I am curious if the EPA is so beneficial to corporations why are they so keen on getting rid of it? Is it just a song and dance?
     
  22. Dr. Rice

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    The idea of getting rid of a government agency that is about regulating the environment when we live in a world full of Halliburton and BPs is absurd. Reform it yes, but to abolish it is absurd because you are going to have to replace it with something else.
     
  23. umkemesik

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    Uhm what. I'm not insinuating nothing, it is a Police State. (1) The number of confined people - most in the world even adjusting for population, 1 out of 32 are on some type of parole or supervision. (2) We are under constant surveillance. (3) The "War on Drugs" is an excuse to inflate police and local Government budgets, which, incidentally, is the same reason why the Government will do nothing about illegal immigration. When there was talk about deporting illegals in California jails the number one opposition came from THE POLICE/CORRECTIONAL UNIONS.

    The US Government wants more laws, bigger budgets, and YOU doing nothing but jacking off to internet porn like the sedated monkey you are.

    Quit insinuating we live in a "Free" country. The elections are rigged and its only a matter of time before this empire collapses.
     
  24. Scorch

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    LOL, IT'S NOT A FUCKING POLICE STATE. WE DON'T LIVE IN A "FREE" COUNTRY, BECAUSE THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS TRUE FREEDOM.

    Unless there are hundreds of ballistic-clad police officers marching down the street, holding fully automatic rifles in their hands while enforcing strict curfew, then we're NOT A FUCKING POLICE STATE. JUST STOP. In comparison to other regions like the Middle East or China, our judicial system is a Goddamn care center.

    THE PEOPLE WHO SAY THAT THE UNITED STATES IS A POLICE STATE ARE THE OCCUPY WALL-STREET JIZZUMS THAT COMPLAIN THAT THEIR CUFFS ARE TOO TIGHT.

    ALL CAPS FOR INTENSE FUCKING IMPACT.
     
  25. uberfukken

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  26. umkemesik

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    Yeah, because the EPA did a fabulous job w/ BP.

    My argument is not that an EPA isn't necessary at the STATE level, it's useless in the Federal level. But you may have a point concerning international posts (like oil rigs). I think we see eye-to-eye but will not argue over semantics. I believe the EPA should be wiped out an its powers delegated to other agencies.

    A few months ago I went through an exercise creating a budget and what I would reform.

    Below are the departments I would keep. I cannot attach my entire work, but will make a thread soon.

    In my plan, I would have each department in charge of its own Environmental Protection. So the Department of Agriculture will have their own Safety specialist as well as the Department of Commerce and Labor.

    I would keep the education Department, but instead of pumping billions into nothing, the money will go to MAKE SCHOOL DAYS YEAR ROUND.

    School would be year round, three four month semesters with a two week break at the end of each one. The first two months would be fundamentals (Math, History, English, Science). The last semester will be electives (Computer Programming,CAD, Engineering, NOT ART) but ONLY if you received passing grades in fundies, or else you would repeat those classes.

    My education system would not hold people back a grade for failing either. You're done after 12 years, plain and simple. You would obtain your degree after passing a GED-like test at the end.



    1 § 2; The Cabinet of the United States

    I. The Office of the Vice President

    II. Department of State

    III. Department of Defense

    IV. Department of Homeland Security

    V. Department of Finance

    VI. Department of Justice

    VII. Department of Labor

    VIII. Department of Commerce

    IX. Department of Agriculture

    X. Department of Health and Services

    XI. Department of Infrastructure

    XII. Department of Education

    XIII. Department of Energy

    XIV. Department of Veteran Affairs
     
  27. uberfukken

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    they dont need to march down the streets kicking random shit when they can just tap your phonecalls for fun

    our domestic intelligence agencies are over funded and have unlimited power. this is a police state.
     
  28. Scorch

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  29. uberfukken

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  30. uberfukken

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    you fucking retard, the shit is real. they don't even deny it.