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Discussion in 'Religion & Politics' started by Baya Rae 4900, Jan 12, 2012.
Prove me wrong.
I got nothing. The Member Formerly Known As Baya is right.
Including the gyms, fitness instructors, organic food, native flora and fauna, rocks, educational television, libraries, and books?
Yes but only those on the lunatic fringe use any of those things.
I can't refute that.
Well that was a short debate. Am I getting better or are you guys getting worse?
I think less people care.
But to indulge you: How can you honestly think only "lunatic fringe" people use books? I love to read, I even bought two (digital) books recently. Almost everyone I know reads at least occasionally (even my brother who hates reading) - this is including family, friends, coworkers, and coworkers of family. I agree with you regarding organic foods; when I think of Whole Foods Market which sells a lot, maybe only, organic foods, I think of nature loving hippies, or "lunatic fringe" as you say. But gyms, really? Those are pretty mainstream. There are lots of gyms where I live, hell even my apartment complex has a workout center.
So in my opinion, only organic foods makes me think of weirdos. One note, though: I live in a big city, so how your question relates to hicks and rednecks and such I can't say, because I don't really know.
And fuck you I love rocks.
Edit: I forgot to mention libraries. It's true those are less often used (I think - I haven't been in one for years). But with stores like Half Price Books and the popularity of the Nook and Kindle, people are still reading, even without libraries.
What you read is fiction, bullshit or irrelevant. You say Americans work out yet America's obesity rate is the highest in the world. It seems to me that Americans use gyms a few times a week and hiking (or whatever) once a month as an excuse to not do proper exercise. Your move.
How does fiction makes Americans fat, lazy, or confused? Some fiction is good reading. Can you honestly say everyone else in the world reads nothing but non-fiction and the like? And what exactly is wrong with reading fiction? I'm legitimately curious.
Obesity: I googled it, because I didn't know the exact statistics. According to this site, the United States has the highest obesity at 30.6%. So, you're right there. But wouldn't that mean 69.4% of Americans are not obese? While it's true almost a third of all Americans are obese, which is, I admit, sad compared to the next two highest obesity rates of Mexico at 24.2% and the UK at 23%, but your statement that everything we have or do in America is designed to make us fat doesn't hold up, since 69.4% of Americans aren't obese. What do they do to keep from being fat? Work out, take walks, go camping, eat healthy? Some do, and some are naturally slim. But not everything we do is designed to make us fat. Sure, lots of stuff is, including fast food like McDonalds and increasingly popular television, but there are also plenty that try to keep us from getting obese. And apparently almost 70% of people in America are utilizing at least some of those things.
If you're going to waste time and energy memorising useless information then it's better to do it with superior mediums unless superior mediums aren't available. Let's concentrate on America, since I never wrote that the rest of the world was peachy by any means. Though they take their cue from America, but that's beside the point. Let's take American MSM (mainstream media) for instance. All MSM, regardless of medium and other specifics. The American MSM is notoriously corrupt and incompetent. I don't think I need to explain it. Take yourself, for instance. No doubt you know something, as fact, that the MSM either doesn't report on, misrepresents or outright lies about. Does it make you angry when this happens? Does it make you frustrated?
Obese isn't fat. Obese is morbidly fat. Anyway, you sort of left out the whole "lazy" part of the equation. I don't know why you're stuck on fat. Isn't being lazy and confused worse than being fat? But yeah, other nations have populations which can't afford to go to gyms and the like yet don't have a fraction of obesity rates America has. We can go into the specific reasons why but in the end it's because Americans like to gorge themselves. Don't lie to me. I've seen your "supersized" meals. America has the largest rate of drug consumption. It's part of the culture, you see. Part of the mentality. Americans can't take anything in measure. They have to go beyond the limit. All the companies and the like are merely supplying demand. The demand being that Americans can't control themselves. It shows in other aspects, like on the world stage.
Oh it is that time of the month for The Member Formerly Known As Baya in which it lasts all month.
I left out lazy and confused because I can't even think of an example of something that's supposed to make us lazy and confused. Help me out, if you would.
Wait, who said anything about memorizing? Just because I read or hear something, means I have to memorize it? That would be a waste of brain space ("attic space", if you don't mind me taking from Sir Doyle's analogy). Also, I don't quite understand what you're trying to say. I know something that mainstream media misrepresents about me? So - MSM says gamers are fat and ugly and shutins. Since this misrepresents me, does it make me angry, is that what you're saying? I suppose it annoys me when MSM declares something that is wrong. I don't watch tv but I'm on the internet often enough to know that tv in particular is pretty much fail these days. I guess, American tv specifically, but I don't really know about elsewhere. I'm guessing you're saying that MSM is designed to make us confused (is that where that comes in?). While in some instances it is confusing (Jersey Shore, anyone?), I'm not really sure it's purposefully designed to make us confused. Although it does seem sometimes that reality tv in general is purposefully melting brain cells so it's watched more.
Obesity is defined by webmd as 20% over normal weight, and then there's the distinction of morbid obesity (additional sauce if you like). I'm pretty sure those statistics just tally the amount of people who are 20% over their normal weight. Regardless, I concede that some Americans like to gorge themselves, hence the "supersized meals" that you mention. It's true, some people eat too much and get fat because of it. Even at restaurants portions can be rather big. But still, your original point that everything is supposed to make us fat is untrue, since there are places with portion control, there are places that sell healthy foods, even some fast food places with healthy options (but I won't deny those are probably not utilized much).
So, dealt with fat. Confusion, coming from MSM? Anywhere else? And lazy, no examples come to mind. I guess, universal remotes? I don't know, give me an example?
The Member Formerly Known As Baya, Ibn Khaldun discusses something similar to your purpose behind this thread. He talks about how civilization in general makes all humans fat, stupid, and confused. We could be strong, smart, and mentally aware, but none of us want to live like nomadic berbers, so we enjoy the pleasures of civilized society. If you really had a problem with this, why are you using the internet and not milking a camel?
The Member Formerly Known As Baya, the hate you pour in your anti-american rants makes them a lot weaker, don't you know?
You must improve your act, mate
Anyways, more actual data:
Right to the point
I'm pretty sure we're not living like nomads because we enjoy being able to read/write/count, living past the age of thirty, not expecting most of our children to never see their second birthday and not having to forage for food when better/cheaper alternatives are available.
But we take things too far. This applies to what @Sublime was asking, too. What we want is insurance and not having to work. The free market forces people to be adaptive and to take risks. People don't like having to be adaptive and they certainly don't like to take risks. So they have the government intervene. So they form unions/cartels/guilds/rackets. To ensure that they can pillage the most for themselves for the least amount of work/investment. But in the end there's no such thing. America is a prime example of this. Costs come due. Eventually. Always.
You sound like your talking more about the eurofags than anything in america.
Ntch..way to miss the point
And the point is that the core paradox of civilization is that it makes overall population weaker, because they don't need to be strong
As a great man (5...4...3...) once said: "The essence of civilization is that the strong have a duty to protect the weak."
But even more to ensure that they bosses/landlords/Counts/etc can't pillage the most for themselves for the least amount of work/investment.
Later, as always, those entities gain life of their own, and stray from their original purpouse, mutating to fulfill their own agendas of survival, usually with no real control from their components
The Wire, e.g talks precisely about that process
Until you learn to see the two sides of the coin, your argumentations will keep being weak
Entire US of A had to be built without any preset, preexistent structures nor imperatives larger than what could be transplanted through the help of confused settlers and land partition charts due to horrid uselessness of previous tenants.
With entire nation thus forced to grow around the very essence of human behaviourism - even despite giving birth to numerous beings whose work was to turn this tide, it is a terrible oversight on your turn to expect sights that not even alternate history could grow.
But I digress. Now, The Member Formerly Known As Baya, let's sit together in a circle and praise high evolutionary ground of CCCP and Warsaw Pact instead.
First I'll address the relationship of the unions/quasi-unions and I'll be kind enough to ignore the history of union negligence/abuse. The bosses are the ones that'll be making investments in businesses, supplying demand and the like. If the money goes to the union then it'll be spent on bullshit. Saving up money and later investing it into something productive is what separates the smart from the stupid. (Or the strong from the weak, to use your term.)
Which brings me to my next point. Civilisation, strength and weakness are relative terms. These days we have replaced competition between physical strength with that of mental strength. The remnants of extensions of physical power, governments, cartels, unions, nepotism and the like, are dying and being replaced by individualism, levelled competition, meritocracy and the like. The "strong" have ruled but because they are stupid and don't wish to mentally adapt, their world is falling down around them. That's why Americans are still talking about themselves as if they were still relevant (in a positive way) to the rest of the world. Because they're strong and stupid. That's why it's dying.
In philosophical terms, those that think they're strong will take comfort in that and become lazy. Thus weak. Those that think themselves weak will strive to become strong.
Keep in mind that America was created before the industrial revolution. As far as its "industry" before the First American Revolution, it was the same as (if not stronger than) most European colonial powers. It had a lot of Burghers while Europe was still plagued by aristocracies.
Oh yes our nation with the most desirable college system in the world was built upon by our stupidity. Let me go hur and dur over here while you in Australia, which by far is the greatest nation on earth, enjoy a nation NOT full of petrol sniffing natives and the non-native population full of criminal genes who were only put there because it was the most godforsaken place a powerful empire could find. Oh wait, that IS Australia, lol nevermind, enjoy your submission to America. Cause after we are gone, you are going to be at China's whim and if you are lucky, India. Both of I am sure care about whatever color your skin is.
I'm sorry but the only people who idolise the American education system do so out of ignorance. Not only is a massive drain on resources but, in relation to the cost, it's completely ineffective at doing what it's designed to do. Unless it's designed to indoctrinate.
And no, neither China nor India have shown the ability or intent of behaving like America.
But for you, they aren't
For you, anything which remotely smells of american is, by definition, uncivilized and weak
Who are you trying to cheat feigning objetivity?
Oh yes, the education system that so many young foreign citizens from all around the world desire to get their degrees at is clearly ineffective. Please try harder.
India and China aren't behaving that way because they don't have a long list of military munitions companies that dictate their policy. Give it a few decades and you'll see they are no better than us.
I was about to point out the meaninglessness of the Chinese example, but then I saw that The Member Formerly Known As Baya included 'ability' along with 'intent'. The Member Formerly Known As Baya's beloved recreational game of anti-American chess crossed me out.
why do you hate America?
Because they raped his mother and slaughtered his people.