Creationist or Evolutionist?

Discussion in 'Religion & Politics' started by BeardBrain, Apr 3, 2012.

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Creationist or Evolutionist?

  1. Young Earth Creationist

    2 vote(s)
    6.7%
  2. Old Earth Creationist

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  3. Theistic Evolutionist/Progessive Creationist

    6 vote(s)
    20.0%
  4. Reformed (Deist/Moral/Anti-Eugenics) Evolutionist

    3 vote(s)
    10.0%
  5. Darwinian Evolutionist

    19 vote(s)
    63.3%
  1. BeardBrain

    BeardBrain
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    I am a Young Earth Creationist, mainly because of the First and Second Laws of Thermodynamics.

    Anyways, discuss.

    [​IMG]

    EDIT: I wrote "progressive" wrong. Mind that.
     
  2. Dr. Rice

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    I said I was a "
    Reformed (Deist/Moral/Anti-Eugenics) Evolutionist" but I do believe/support Eugenics. Also have you seen Expelled: No Intelligence Allowed?
     
  3. BeardBrain

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    Just three days ago. Judging by the reviews, I doubt that the critics actually saw the movie. I knew creationism was classified as "pseudoscience" by many scientific communities and their prejudice agaisnt the belief, but damn...
     
  4. Dr. Rice

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    I thought the same thing too, especially when I saw the ED page. My thoughts is that the Creator (whether it be Aliens, as subtly implied in the film, or God) does not want humans to know the truth so that humanity can go along a specific path of development. Also one of the creationist people was clearly an esoteric occultist given by his line "Yeah Religion makes people smart" (I am paraphrasing). As an esoteric occultist, I can tell you when people say shit like this, it is a little red flag they are raising to get others on board with them.
     
  5. Akula

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    Rice, your posts are 50% strange, 50% gold.
     
  6. Dr. Rice

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    I should rewatch Expelled and write a commentary about it. The movie raised several points I liked besides that microbiology is so complex, that the theories we have about the origin of life (from when inorganic became organic) is so inadequate to explain even simple bacteria cells developing. For instance, while we have hypothesizes about how life first arisen, we cannot replicate any of these under controlled conditions. Not to mention that no evidence is from the historical record. Apparently we've had 3.5 billion years of single cell life on our planet before a rapid explosion of life that created dinosaurs in about 500 million years from single cell creatures.


    If organic beings really did rise from inorganic beings, then my argument that magnetism (from the earth's molten core) plays a huge part in this. Though I don't believe anyone is looking into this, but given that I don't have too much faith in these scientists given that they are completely unwilling to discuss this show even slight grounds for intellectual curiosity. As one of the creationist scientists said: "The side with the best evidence is ultimately the right person."

    The film also brings up points about: eugenics, Nazism, and force evolution or selective breeding.
     
  7. Slavoj Jizzek

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    Ah, theistic cosmology. The "we need him therefore he is" approach. As a purported religious nut, I have to admit that I do subscribe to the idea that there is a bigger asshole out there than me.

    However relegating him to the the logical starting point of a cause ironically renders him a victim of causality. If this god becomes a god whose sole reason is for the universe to exist, he becomes a facet of our need created by us rather than an actual independent being. A god of the gaps is every bit a god of our imaginations.

    However a god who rejects the roles relegated to him by the nature of causality exists beyond human rationality and human understanding and therefore never falls subject to the limitation of human conceptualization. A causal god is rendered impotent against humanity by sheer virtue that humans dictate which of his qualities and attributes are important or necessary. This god is a projection of our desires of god.

    I suppose what I am getting at is that to believe in a god because it is a logical starting point to explain life is natural, although not ultimately beneficial to you or, if he exists, to this god.
     
  8. GSTalbert1

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    Well if you want to believe in intelligent design/creationism that's fine but if you are arguing from a juedao-christian concept then your out of luck in that arena. I mean surrounding the development of cosmology in the ancient world in that area you have two concepts: Polytheism and Monotheism (though it's important to keep in mind those are anachronisms, they would have made no distinction between monotheism and modern scientific theory as both purport that everything submits to order. This naturally includes the Platonic and Aristotelian God. Oh and hell ya gotta throw in Marduk as well). So the importance of genesis is that "God rested" meaning that "God" is finished with creation and needs not to continually intercede in it's renewal, like Ra or the Babylonian epic; nor does "God" set laws forth then break them. Any miracle or perceived interaction with "God" is merely through foreknowledge and thus merely divine coincidence. Ironically intelligent design is blasphemous according to the bible.
     
  9. CallMeMaggot

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    Oh, but all that's because we don't understand shit about auto-organization and phase changes in recursive complex systems...which make a huge part of the universe

    And trying to replicate one of those in a lab is ludicrous, btw



    ntch...fucking magnets
     
  10. CallMeMaggot

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    Out of aestetics, I fancy the Theistic Evolutionist/Progessive Creationist option, but of course I don't pretend to be able to demonstrate shit...

    Lol, which one isn't?

    Of course, if there is any god, he is obviously not-omnipotent (because that concept leads to Paradox-land) and it doesn't give a fuck about my petty problems

    And a causal God is only another elephant upon another turtle, obviously...but works to pass the ball to the last (universe/cycle) neighbours

    “That is not dead which can eternal lie,
    And with strange aeons even death may die.”
     
  11. Corn Hole Bob

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    why can't we just all agree that god created evolution?
    if we could all just embrace the fact that we're all 'mostly' correct, then this whole argument would never happen. seriously, why don't you darwinist fanbois and christfags just come together and admit that ALL people are just plain fucking stupid. Then we could have a giant man train, and go nuke some people who actually deserve it.
     
  12. GSTalbert1

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    Not to belittle your point but the line of rhetoric your using was shown to be little more than nonsensical word games which indeed belittles your point.
    It also means God doesn't exist or not exist.
     
  13. Baya Rae 4900

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    Uh... I believe in evolution but I think that successive generational mutations occur largely as a result of our bodies trying to adapt to our environment and I also believe that inactive genes are activated within our spawn if stimulated before we breed. (The latter ties in with the former.) What's that called?
     
  14. Corn Hole Bob

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    of course god exists. Look around you. do you honestly believe all those hideous people you see at Wal mart happened on accident? yes god exists and he has one hell of a sense of humor
     
  15. GSTalbert1

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    Sorry about that, I shouldn't have used the word "can't", not that it matters all that much. And yes, God is responsible for the Internets.
     
  16. GSTalbert1

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    Neo-Lamarkiansm?
     
  17. CallMeMaggot

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    wow

    Yeah, horror-fiction tends to be nonsensical...

    It seems I can't fin a Lovecraft-facepalm pic, so you'll have to go with this one:

    uarearetardsir.
     
  18. GSTalbert1

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    And pumpernickel is a man in Rhodes, here it is jump now!
     
  19. Corn Hole Bob

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    moar like eugenics there buddy. most people are born perfectly normal, but for some reason the stupid fuckers keep reproducing, i.e. , my belief is that in 20 years stupid people will outnumber us intellectuals 3/1.

    for example, just read this article: http://www.nytimes.com/roomfordebate/2012/02/26/are-people-getting-dumber

    my only opinion on this matter is that stupid people are way, WAY more inclined to fuck ugly chicks than your average (sober) netizen.
     
  20. Baya Rae 4900

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    Looking it up now.

    Hm. That only deals with the former. What about the latter?
     
  21. CallMeMaggot

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    despite ur efforts to act upon ur beliefs, it don't work like that, bro

    [​IMG]
     
  22. GSTalbert1

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    I don't know, what we do know of fossil records shows that it's insane and we've not the slightest idea how it works. Sure we get the basics but it's far more complicated than any of us realize. Literally it seems a lizard lays an egg and a bird hatches. So ya got me.
     
  23. GSTalbert1

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    Maggot
     
  24. Baya Rae 4900

    Baya Rae 4900
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    So what you're saying is that I've just invented a new school of thought.

    [​IMG]
     
  25. CallMeMaggot

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    Tell me, bro
     
  26. CallMeMaggot

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    We realize, but can do shit about...at least yet

    I very much recommend this reading on the subject
     
  27. BeardBrain

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    As usual, the origin of life is a philosophical question. Yet, many people are stupid enough to call it 'scientific'. Sure, we can use data and math calculations to assume, but since it can't be observed, tested and repeated in the presence, it is not scientific.

    Since Young Earth Creationism, Old Earth Creationism and Theistic Evolutionist has eyewitness accounts on the situation, I'd be more eager to rely on that.
     
  28. BeardBrain

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    lol People actually rely on ED articles?



    Never thought of it that way.



    I'm not sure if this quote is true, but Einstein once said...
    From what I can tell, what Einstein is saying here is that a scientist without knowledge on the origin of life and/or universe is blind. (Assuming, mind you)



    Religion doesn't make people smart, science doesn't either. Science and religion has its limits, this is why philosophy exists ie. interpreting the evidence (Data, cosmological arguments, scientific laws vs. age of the universe, etc.)
     
  29. Beefcake

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    Explains this, because I doubt that it makes any sense at all.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miller–Urey_experiment
    It seems like you don't know anything at all. Saying something is impossible, just because you don't understand it is pretty close to an argument from ignorance.
     
  30. CallMeMaggot

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    Me too

    That was pretty interesting, yeah...but quite limited too, the jump from simple aminoacids to proteins and RNA, etc is inmense